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 Post subject: The strumpets at Disney
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2004 9:18 am 
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Recently, my English teacher assigned a paper, in which we had to dicuss any art form we wished in terms of modernism or postmodernism, which is a pretty righteous assignment, if you ask me.

Anyway, I chose to write about how Disney movies differ from the original stories they come from, specifically focusing on The Hunchback of Notre Dame, and how this reflects a postmodern attitude, but that's not important.

And once I realized just how different the movie was from Victor Hugo's original tale, I realized that most if not all Disney movies that are based on other stories, really suck. I never realized this before, but I think Disney ruins the stories they are based on :x

Please comment...


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2004 4:07 pm 
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Hello Kujo! I like Disney movies but I have noticed something interesting. Let me know if you've noticed too or if I'm just crazy. Well, in most of the animated/classic movies there are usually only one parent.


Cinderella - no mom then no dad (dad is shown killed)
Aladdin - Jasmine= no mom Aladin= no parents (original movie not new)
Snow White - no dad
The Lion King - no dad (show him die)
Bambi -no mom (show her die)
The Little Mermaid - no mom
Beauty and the Beast - no mom

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2004 9:36 pm 
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Hi Kujo: I have felt that way about Disney movies since I became a teacher (I don't have kids of my own, so that's how I became exposed to the movies). Disney has had such power to teach, influence, and inform kids. I don't know why they've felt it was necessary to change (sometimes even corrupt) the stories they've retold. Nor do I understand why they felt they had to use animals to personify human characters, as in Robin Hood. (Is there a literary term for this? :| ) I'd love to read all or part of your paper. Good luck!

Perfectionist: I've noticed this tendency too! Although I'll have to defend Disney regarding at least one of your examples. Didn't the original Cinderella (Hans Christian Anderson?) have no mother? On the other hand, most of the Disney-created story lines do feature single-parented children... Nemo's mom was killed at beginning of that movie too. Do you think that's because it adds to the tragedy/emotion of the story and builds sympathy for the character? Personally, I think it's a trite and cheap way to do so! :!:

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 9:37 am 
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In response to Quest, I'm glad we see eye to eye. When I brought this topic up to some fellow students, their immediate reaction was one of disgust. "Why are you bashing Disney? I love Disney!" one girl said to me. But I am by no means bashing it; I grew up enjoying them, too. It is just that, when I found out how much they differ from their original stories, I was shocked. Anyway, thank you for seeing my point of view.

As for the paper, it is currently in the rough draft stage, but I'd be happy to post it once it is finished.

Also, in response to Perfectionist, I don't think I ever realized that, but you're right. It probably is to add to the emotional appeal.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2004 4:03 am 
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This is one of my pet peeves also, although I understand sometimes you don't want to let the truth get in the way of a good story.

My favorite silly adaptation of literature is "Muppet Christmas Carol". It's funny, and ridiculous, and there are frogs and bears and pigs playing the characters, but the story follows Dickens very closely and even includes more lines from the original story than many "serious" adaptations.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 8:23 am 
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This is true. Not all Disney movies are ridiculously erroneous. Some of the older one's tend to be better. But come on. In the Hunchback of Notre Dame, Quasimodo dies in the end. Now, I can understand not wanting to include this because it will make little kids cry, but then Disney makes a sequel? That's ridiculous :x

I've found that some of the best Disney movies are those that aren't based on original stories, or, at least, are based on stories that i don't know about, like...

Bambi
Lilo and Stitch
The Lion King (loosely based on Hamlet)

These are such good movies because I can watch them without feeling like the are ruining anything, unless these are based on other stories that I don't know about. Correct me if I'm wrong.

And Quest, if you ever see this, I was wondering. What kind of teacher are you?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2004 7:11 pm 
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Wow.... I never heard that the Lion King was ased on Hamlet! Is that your observation, Kujo? Or have the Disney writers acknowledged it? Makes me want to watch it all over again!

Kujo, I'm a teacher of the deaf. I teach at the grade school level in an oral school. Oral schools do not use or teach sign language, but teach the students spoken language and speechreading (lipreading).

I'm really enjoying this Disney theme. Does anyone have any other revelations of Disney (or other) kids' movies 'based-on' "real" literature?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 11:42 am 
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I'm not sure if Disney ever officially declared Lion King to be based on Hamlet, but I've heard it so many times. Plus everything fits:

Hamlet's father (Mufasa) is killed by his brother (Scar) and then marries the wife and becomes king. The son, Hamlet (Simba), has to seek revenge for his father's death. Nearly everyone from the play is there: Ophelia is Nala, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Timon and Pumbaa, etc. The only major difference, and I mean major, is the sugarcoating characteristic of all Disney movies, like in The Hunchback of Notre Dame.

It definitely makes the movie more enjoyable, and :D rewatched it and reread the play when i found this out.

I recommend you do the same :D


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 11:48 am 
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P.S. Sorry about that stray emoticon before "rewatched." That doesn't mean anything. I put it there by mistake.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 1:06 pm 
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Thanks, again, Kujo! Now... I just have to figure out how to justify renting the movie! :wink:

By the way, did you know you can edit a message (and get rid of those unintended emoticons!) after you post it? Just click on the "Edit" button at the top right of the message. Like I had to do to fix a typo in the message you just replied to!

I have to ask again, because you've really piqued my curiosity... do you know of any other literary bases for Disney movies?

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:24 am 
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I can't think of any that aren't common sense. Snow white is obviously based on Snow White, Cinderella on Cinderella, etc.

There could be some that I am just not aware of; I'm not a Disney expert or anything. But I'm glad I piqued your interest.

And the paper should be coming soon, just in case you're still interested.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:43 pm 
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It's a little more complicated to say simply that Cinderella is "based Cinderella."

The "Cinderella" legend, like the legend of "Beauty and the Beast" exists in almost every world culture. The earliest known written version is from ninth century China. The Disney version of Cinderella is based upon Cendrillion, as told by Charles Perrault in Histories ou Contes du temps passe (1697).
http://www.americanroyalarts.com/ViewIn ... Cinderella
Perrault is also responsible for writing the story which was the source of Disney's Sleeping Beauty.
http://trivia.disneysites.com/cinderella.html

There is also:
the Rossini opera "La Cenerentola", which was first staged in 1817
http://www.ndl.go.jp/en/publication/ndl ... 6/264.html
There is also:
"The Native American Cinderella" is based on a story of the same name from Canadian Wonder Tales by Cyrus MacMillan (John Lane, London, 1918), pp.116-119.
http://expedition.bensenville.lib.il.us ... /tale1.htm
There is also:
The Golden Sandal: A Middle Eastern Cinderella Story by Rebecca Hicox
This version of Cinderella is based on an Iraqi story called "The Little Red Fish and the Clog of Gold."
http://depts.washington.edu/uwch/silkro ... alton.html
The Korean Cinderella
This adaptation of Cinderella is based on 3 versions of the tale known in Korea.
http://www.greenline.co.nz/books/The-Ko ... erella.htm
I highly recommend the movie Ever After
http://www.virtual-paper.com/whistler/c ... enDocument

Cinderella is based on the [supposed] true life of an Egyptian prostitute from over 2,000 years ago.
Rhodopis is…the central character of an Egyptian fairy tale similar to "Cinderella". In it, an eagle steals a slipper from Rhodopis and deposits it before the Pharaoh Amasis. Amasis, impressed with the delicate slipper, tries it on all the women in his dominion. Upon learning that it belongs to Rhodopis, Amasis marries her, making her Queen of Egypt.
http://wondersmith.com/heroes/rhodopis.htm


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 Post subject: Parents die?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:26 pm 
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Yea, I've realized that many Disney movies have had a parents die in them.

Finding Nemo- mother dies

Snow White- mother dies, unknown father

Cinderella- mother is dead

Bambi- mother dies

Lion King- father dies

Little Mermaid- Ariel has no mother

Beauty and the Beast- Beauty has no mother

The Jungle Book- Moguli has no parents

Peter Pan- Peter has no parents

Tarzan- Jane has no mother

Pocahontas- no mother

Alladin- Alladin has no parents and Jasmine has no mother

Sleeping Beauty- has no mother

Brother Bear (a new movie)- mother dies, no father

Sometimes, like other people have said, the folklore that the movies are based on are like that.

There is also another very simple reason why so many movies are like that- the death of a parent or both parents makes the movie happen. More instance, in Snow White or Cinderella, how could they have had "evil stepmothers" if their mothers hadn't died (divorce does not count; there were few, if any, divorces back then). Bambi wouldn't have been alone if his mother hadn't died. Simba runs away because he thought he killed his father. Marlin, Nemo's father, was so protective of him because Marlin's wife, Nemo's mother, died. So many things in a movie depend on who dies. But you know what? Most of Disney's famous movies had people who had died previously or who die in the movie.

What I don't understand is how they need to exclude things from movies "for the childrens' sake" if they include so many death's in their movies. I couldn't watch Bambi when I was little because I was worried my own mother would die. I know this isn't the way with everyone, but...

Just a thought. Let me know that you think.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 3:51 pm 
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Interestingly enough, Pinnochio kills the cricket early on in the original novel. :wink:


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:45 am 
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Nor do I understand why they felt they had to use animals to personify human characters, as in Robin Hood. (Is there a literary term for this? )


this is called Anthropomorphism in literary terms.

I am not sure if i am way off topic here or not, but there are also many veiled sexual references in disney movies that i have read about (pop culture class).
one of the most discussed was the cover of the little mermaid video box, which i have a pic of and no idea how to post it....anyhow, it’s under the top point of the castle & between the two outer points and it's unmistakable (male body part..ahem)
also, the priest has an erection during the wedding ceremony. Disney tries to justify that by saying it is just the priest's knees, but take a look...ya right.
In the movie Alladin, When Alladin is at Jasmin's window & trying to calm her tiger down he says "Good teenagers take off their clothes." It's very faint but you can hear it if you pay attention.
and of course one of the most widely known(?) references is in The Lion King When Simba jumps in the dust to run after his father the word "sex" can be seen in the dust.

Also "On 8 January 1999, Disney announced a recall of the the home video version of their 1977 animated feature The Rescuers because it contained an "objectionable background image." Approximately 38 minutes into the film, as rodent heroes Bianca and Bernard fly through the city in a sardine box strapped to the back of Orville, proprietor of Albatross Air Charter Service, the photographic image of a topless woman can be seen at the window of a building in the background in two different (non-consecutive) frames" (snopes)
I also have pictures of those frames. if you are interested..

wow, i need a life! 8O

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