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 Post subject: Giving up to win
PostPosted: Sat Jun 28, 2003 4:35 pm 
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The quote I'm looking for refers to us only attaining that which we are willing to forgo. Is that muddled? Sorry. It's a quotation that's hovering at the edge of my mind.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2003 2:01 am 
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I tried, but didn't have much luck.

"Curious how often you humans attain that which you don't want. Organians have no one in authority - just a council of elders. A great intuitive. Terrible to destroy. Ideological differences make them different as a species. Developed beyond the need for physical bodies. Kirk says that we think of ourselves as the most powerful beings in the universe - it's unsettling to find out we are not. It took even the Gods millions of years to come into being."
~ quote from "Star Trek: Errand of Mercy"
http://startrek22.com/starpage4.html

“The body is a source of endless trouble to us by reason of the mere requirement of food; and also is liable to diseases which overtake and impede us in the search after truth; and by filling us as full of loves, and lusts, and fears, and fancies, and idols . . . prevents our ever having . . . so much as a thought.”
The reality of the body is apparently an enemy of thought; and true knowledge can arise only apart from the body:
“we shall attain that which we desire . . . and that is wisdom . . . not while we live, but after death . . . for if while in company with the body, the soul can not have pure knowledge, one of two things seems to follow—either knowledge is not to be attained at all, or, if at all, after death”
~ apparently attributed to Socrates
http://www.stolaf.edu/people/booth/is204tops.html

Moreover, if there is time and an inclination toward philosophy, yet the body introduces a turmoil and confusion and fear into the course of speculation, and hinders us from seeing the truth: and all experience shows that if we would have pure knowledge of anything we must be quit of the body, and the soul in herself must behold all things in themselves: then I suppose that we shall attain that which we desire, and of which we say that we are lovers, and that is wisdom, not while we live, but after death, as the argument shows; for if while in company with the body the soul cannot have pure knowledge, one of two things seems to follow—either knowledge is not to be attained at all, or, if at all, after death. For then, and not till then, the soul will be in herself alone and without the body. In this present life, I reckon that we make the nearest approach to knowledge when we have the least possible concern or interest in the body, and are not saturated with the bodily nature, but remain pure until the hour when God himself is pleased to release us. And then the foolishness of the body will be cleared away and we shall be pure and hold converse with other pure souls, and know of ourselves the clear light everywhere; and this is surely the light of truth. For no impure thing is allowed to approach the pure.
~ Plato. The Apology, Phædo and Crito
http://www.bartleby.com/2/1/31.html


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